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  • To Keep or not to Keep

    91 posts, 33 voices, 3259 views, started Sep 24, 2008

    Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 by Butterscotch

    •  



    • Amethyst
      Offline

      When and how do you decide how to save a marriage?  Should the decision be made by consensus or should you dig in and fight for what you believe in even if the other party doesn’t agree?



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Almostfive0 wrote Sep 24, 2008
        • Wow butterscotch..that is a good question and honestly and unfortunately one that I have thought about personally off and on for a few years now.
          I have been married since I was 24 and have been married for 24 years. My husband and I met in high school and well...long story short...What do you really know when you are 16/17 years old.
          We have gone throught quite a lot in our relationship. We love each other but relationships aren’t meant to stay the same and you both have to grow.
          I guess if I felt that my husband really wanted to leave and verbaly said so but I wanted to fight for the relationship what could I possibly do but let him leave. You can’t make someone feel a certain way simply because you want them to bad enough.
          It has to be decided by both people that they want to work on keeping the marriage together. And both people have to be honest in sharing their feelings.



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          Mary Kelly-Williams, M.A. wrote Sep 24, 2008
        • Butterscott, I’m going to respectfully disagree with almostfive o.  It is a myth that both people need to want to work on the marriage to keep it together.  At least initially.  This is a common misunderstanding, even marriage counselors make this mistake.

          Studies show that when marriages are in trouble, there is usually one motivated person who wants to keep the marriage together and one that has lost interest.  As a therapist, I have no problem working with the partner invested to help them see their part in things and ways to get their partner interested.

          An excellent resource for doing this is the book [Link Removed] by Michele Weiner-Davis (a great therapist and personal friend).  

          Especially when children are involved, it’s best to try to turn over every stone.  Studies also show that couples who are unhappy with the marriage and stick it out, even for 5 years, end up happier then before the unhappiness.

          Now, let me say that I got divorced after a 21 year marriage and it was the best decision.  But it was after 3 years of a lot of trying, grieving, and searching to see if there was a way.  There is life after divorce...but also I would encourage you to “dig in” before you give up.

          All the best to you,

          Mary


          Mary, Your links have been removed, please consider upgrading to premium membership.



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          Almostfive0 wrote Sep 25, 2008
        • Mary,
          I understand what you are saying. I in no way feel that one should initially throw in the towel before trying to work out their situation.
          Studies aside, ever one’s story is unique.  

          Trust when I say that my husband and I have had to deal with some really serious situations in our marriage that had one of us at any given time not been willing to work it out we would not be together today.
          As a matter of fact it is an ongoing process.  

          In a marriage there are a lot of times that you aren’t going to be on the same page (and that’s in a “good” marriage) those are the days when one or the other person has to be the one that has to try to make the other person see the good in sticking it out.
          My point in what I was initially saying is that I feel after you have tried everything you can to work it out and the other person is just not on board then for your own good you need to move on.
          I still say that you can not make anyone feel something that’s just not there. When it comes down to it and all is said and done both people need to want it.



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Mary Kelly-Williams, M.A. wrote Sep 25, 2008
        • Almsotfiveo:  You and I are in complete agreement, which is why in my response I included the fact that I have gone through divorce.  No one can ever make anyone feel something that’s not there...you are so right about that.

          If you are in a long term marriage, I trust you when you say you have had to/are dealing with serious situations...in fact, when anyone is in a long term marriage, most couples have to go through some intense times before they get to the other end.

          And I apologize if you felt I suggested that you were a person who just threw in the towel.  I just have worked with too many clients who are willing to do that, and it can be short sighted.

          You are a testimony to the honesty and difficulty real marriages involve, and absolutely I agree with you that some point BOTH partners need to be invested.



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          Almostfive0 wrote Sep 25, 2008
        • Very well and beautifully said Joyfull.
          Isn’t it wonderful that there is a place where we can get so many different perspectives on issues and know that they are all coming from sincere thoughtfulness, compassion, wisdom and love?
          peace.



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          Debjr wrote Sep 25, 2008
        • Butterscotch,

          First off, I am so sorry the you are having relationship problems.  Second is, take a look at the book titled “Too good to leave; Too bad to stay:  Dealing with Relationship Ambivilence” by Mira Tannenbaum (I think).  It would assist you in making any type of relationship decision.  I am sure that whatever you decide on will be the right choice.  All the best to you.

          Debbie



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Debjr wrote Sep 25, 2008
        • Oops, the author of the above book is Mira Kirshenbaum.  I just looked it up online.  Soory for the wrong name.

          Debbie



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Pat Thompson wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • I married my husband 27 years ago, when I was 18.  We were so in love and knew that the decision was right.  Over the years we grew and we grew apart.  We couldn’t communicate effectively anymore and sad to say, we spent about 10 years living together more like roommates that husband/wife.  We got to a point where neither of us could stand it anymore and my husband suggested a trial separation.

          I almost felt relieved.  I really enjoyed living on my own, until evening fell and the apartment was soooooo quiet.  My husband and I still talked at least once a week and spent time together with our grown sons.  Then, one day while working, he just started to weep and couldn’t figure it out.  With much thought, he was weeping over what he lost.  He was rid of the toxic relationship that he wanted to get rid of, but he didn’t want to get rid of me.

          He took me to dinner, shared this story and asked me to go to counseling with him.  He was never willing to go to counseling before the separation.  He found the therapist and set up the first appointment and we’ve been in therapy for about a year now.  

          My story and experience shows that you have to be willing to do whatever it takes if you want your marriage to work out.  For us, that included separating for a while to get some space and perspective.  Separation is scary, because you never know how it will end.  Therapy helped us discover how to communicate and solve problems again.  We were trying to problem solve as the 18 and 22 year old kids that got married, and we weren’t those people anymore.



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          Almostfive0 wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • Thank you for sharing your story platinum. I totally relate to it.
          My husband and I have been together since high school and married at 24. We have gone through a lot in our years together and right now we are living in seperate places which was my decision.
          It was decision that was and still is scary but one I think I needed to make not only for myself but for him as well.
          The funny thing about it though is that niether one of us has ever mentioned the word seperation. This is the first time I’ve ever called it that outloud but it’s exactly what it is.
          I so feel you when you say that you and your husband were trying to solve your problems with the mindset of an 18 and 22 year old... like some kind of arrested emotional developement.

          It’s really challenging to say the least when you have or are starting to figure out the person you really are...you know that certain things are lacking in your relationship but just can’t seem to get passed old habits of communication between the two of you.
          Especially if the other person isn’t on the same page that you are at that time.

          I have learned so much about myself in this passed year.
          I miss my husband a lot. I’ve learned what my role was in our problems and try not to just focus on his. I have also learned to appreciate him and the person that he is becoming.
          And there are nights that are just so quiet I want to scream!...lol
          We will be moving back together soon which is scary as well.
          Hopefully we will get to the point where we can both find help in coming together emotionally as well as physically.
          So far we continue to try and fix it on our own. Me with trying to talk about it while trying to keep my old resentments at bay and him with not talking and defensiveness.
          At any rate, whatever happens will happen. I figure in between time I’ll continue to work on me... which was part of the problem in the first place. ;)
          Peace.



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          Coachmombabe wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • I’ve been married to the same man for 32 years. And for the last 10 (maybe 12) I’ve been really glad! I was not happy in our marriage for a very long time, mostly because I felt neglected. He tends to be a workaholic who owns his own business. I practically raised our three children as a single parent (with the exception of financially). For some reason I never did leave him. And at some point I came to the realization that I could not change him, but I could change me. I made a decision to be content. That was not easy! It was a process of transformation. I learned how to love him how he needed loved. And an amazing thing happened in the meantime. He became the man I thought I had married in the first place. In fact, I love him more now than ever and can’t imagine my life without him. I hope I never have to.

          Some relationships may not be able to be saved. I feel extremely blessed that mine was. I hope yours will too.

          Blessings,
          Cindy



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          Tmpickup wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • I have been married for 16 years now.  However, like coachmombabe, I felt neglected a few years into our marriage.  Once we had kids it felt like my life changed, but his life didn’t.  Then, when someone else starting treating me like a sexy woman instead of a built in babysitter, I strayed.  However, I did not want to leave the marriage because I had two small children.  

          My husband and I went to counseling and with much work and prayers are still HAPPILY married!  Our kids are in 8th & 9th grades now and when I look back I can’t believe that I almost threw away everything I had.

          I think we have to step away from the moment and look back at why we married our spouse.  Sometimes those reasons are forgotten in our busy lives.  If we remember though, we CAN bring back those happy times.  A good marriage does take a TON of work.  Everyone goes through ups and downs.

          I’m glad I put the effort into mine!



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Almostfive0 wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • Thank you Cindy,
          It’s very true you can never change anyone but yourself which is why I ended my comment with,... “I’ll continue to work on me“.

          We need to learn to love ourselves before we can truly love anyone else, which I think I was lacking for a long time...true love of self.
          I think for a long time I depended on my husband to supply me with a lot more than he was able to give...emotionally speaking.
          Though I hold no resentment agaisnt my mother and father or anyone else who had a hand in my emotional upbringing. There were things that I know were lacking from my childhood. Those things that I didn’t even know I was seeking at 17 years old.
          On top of that I was looking for another 17 year old to fill in those gaps.
          All that said I have tremendous hope for me and my husband. Whatever happens I know that we both will be well.



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          Pat Thompson wrote Sep 29, 2008
        • All of the comments about stepping back and looking at yourself are so true.  The only person I can truly control in life is ME!  But, it’s so much easier to look at your significant other and find their faults.  It’s only when you are ready to work on yourself, that you see how wrong and unfair it is to look at their faults.

          It’s all a work in progress, but it’s been great work and a good deal of fun too!  Therapy offers us a “neutral” place to share our thoughts, feelings and expectations.



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          Coachmombabe wrote Sep 30, 2008
        • What an amazing group of very wise women! If only we could get the youngsters to listen! ;o)



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          Sensibleheart wrote Oct 15, 2008
        • Hi everyone, I’m new here and looking for help/info on if should try to save my relationship. I’m not married

          The info in here is very helpful. I’m at a point where there is so much anger towards my b/f, I just want to give up and run away.  

          I’m in therapy for myself and he says he would go to couples therapy, but I’m not even sure I want to anymore

          Keep up the good info ladies



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Sharon101 wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • great forum.  Nice to know that many of us struggle with the same issues.  I’ve been married for 19 years, last year we came really close to divorce - visited a lawyer, consulted real estate advisor on the house, etc. At the last minute, we just coulnd’t do it.  We have 2 kids and decided to go to therapy (for the 3rd time!).  It has helped but we just can’t afford to keep going so we’ve stopped and now we aren’t communicating as well again.  I try to remember that I can only change myself and can only control how I react to a situation, not anyone else.  It is a day-by-day thing.



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        • +1 votes vote up vote up

          Shari Tenner wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • I am waving the white flag of surrender and just giving up on my marriage of 28 years.  I have been in counceling for many many years and my husband comes and goes in therapy but never sticks with it.  He has internet relationships and meets these women socially, while blaming me for my lack of this or that.  Lately he is out and about, wanting to live life to the fullest while I’m home keeping the house, home and office alive and well.  I just feel that the emotional roller coaster of a bad marriage is so damaging to all parties involved, that I would rather be alone and have some peace that together in a relationship that is filled with angst.



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          UK Girl wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • I wish I could have seen all this two years ago. My husband left me very suddenly and it not only broke my heart it also left me with no closure. I so wish we had been able to have counselling or been able to have some closure.

          I did have some great friends to chat with but sometimes you don’t want to drown your friends with your worries so you just bottle it up.



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          (華娃娃) ChinaDoll wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • All I can say “if it is meant to be, it is meant to be“..seek and you will find the answer that is right for your heart and soul. Blessings.



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Lovehearts wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • i agree chinadoll but women need to stay in their head most of the time during this turmoil also and protect their HEART...



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          Dee Dee Shaw wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • For those who are struggling (especially slatrn) go see the movie "Fireproof" - awesome movie, even it isn't a Hollywood production. I took my husband to see it for his birthday. Since then, he has looked for ways to be considerate and loving. I am amazed! If you aren't familiar with it, it is blatantly Christian. It also exposes how we lose sight of why we get married in the first place. I think they could have focused a little more on how she wasn't loving her husband, but for those of us who have men who need to have their eyes opened to how they are selfish, this is the ticket! :)
          I think one of the main problems with have with marriage is not looking at it as a covenant, but as a contract. There have been many times over the past 23 years that I have wanted to toss in the towel, but I was taught that love is an action, a committment, not a feeling. We can fall in and out of emotional love, but we can choose to act and be committed. There have even been times that I wished I had biblical grounds for divorce so I could ask him to leave with a clear conscience. LOL
          Few of us divorce our children - because we are taught differently about that kind of love. It is unconditional, and eternal. I say all this with a caveat: I know there are relationships that need to be severed. I have a dear friend whom I have counseled over and over to leave her louse of a husband. There are always exceptions, but too many people quit for lack of compatibiliy.
          I am glad I did’t give up. I am finding myself happier now than ever (even though circumstances have been better in the past at times. I think it is mainly because I have reached the top of the hill, and am allowing myself the freedom to be *me*.

          Sharing Hope,
          Dee Dee



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          Denise Alleyne-Hill wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • Ok...I’m going to throw this in here...I have been divorced for 4 years now...I would say when it was all said and done, my ex husband didn’t want the divorce, but I went ahead anyway...We had been thru a lot and that just took the life out of me...I stayed with him as long as I could, for the sake of our children...But when I was the one wanting to work on our problems, he laughed it off...When I went and got therapy, he didn’t support me. So I believe that two people have to be on the same page to be able to work things out and stay together...And this is my opinion based on my personal experience...I do not endorse divorce...that’s just the way things happened for us!

          Things ended the way they did because of lack of support...When I was willing to try and salvage things he wasn’t and then when he was, I had no interest...I have no regrets for my decisions, but they were my decisions to make...

          My thing is why try to make someone stay who doesn’t want to stay?...That could build anger and resentment...and why would you want to keep someone who doesn’t want to stay...That, in MY OPINION is not love, but bondage...

          Peace



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Emm2008 wrote Oct 26, 2008
        • I have been married for 11 years and have discussed divorce several times in the last year with my husband. This is following years or therapy with five different therapists! I still have my doubts about staying in a relationship with someone I don’t feel I love anymore, but rather than get into what led up to these feelings I would like to let everyone in on an excellent book that has really changed my way of percieving my marriage and my behavior. It’s called The Divorce Remedy by Michele Weiner Davis. The book adresses many problems that arise in a marriage including can one person work on saving it. Michele focuses on solution based strategies that are very helpful.
          Honestly I wish I had read her book years ago..it would have saved alot of time, money and aggrevation! The Divorce Remedy is a wonderful tool on how to become an positive active participant in your marriage and ultimately a happier and more attractive person.



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          Shari Tenner wrote Oct 27, 2008
        • Working on a marriage takes comittment by both parties.  So how silly it would be to continue therapy and all the hard work, while one party is sharing everything involved with a stranger. Don’t you think?  So while I’m paying 190/hr for marital advise he is text messaging that special someone...don’t call me for an hour, having therapy now...Silly and a waste of time and money.



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          Sweetnsassy wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Your decision also depends on your individual situation.  My husband's infidelity was made known to me after his affair had been going on for a year or more. I was devistated and my whole world came crashing down.  My comment to my best friend was  "I can't go -- but I can't stay". -- So I know what you are feeling there.  I did get the courage to leave after 5 years and it was still difficult but I made the right decision.  I found out more about my husband of 15 years and it wasn't anything good.  Hats off to his mistress for bringing his true character to my attention. So, saying this, you can see it's such a personal decsion for you.  Just remember you always have choices and NEVER SETTLE.



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Heather Mirassou wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Before you give up on your marriage please read “Getting the Love You Want by Harville Hendrix, Ph,D.

          I just finished reading this book. I am extatic!  It is a mirror of your current love relationships and your childhood experience.  The book taught me that my husband is just another “wounded human being“.

          We all have instances in our childhood that we use unconciously while looking for a mate.  We almost always choose a mate with postive and negative characteristics of our parents/caretakers.

          He talks about an “unconscious” marriage and teaches you how to have a “conscious” marriage.  Some of the characteristics of a conscious marriage are:

          You realize your love relationship has a hidden purpose, healing childhood wounds.

          You create a more accurate image of your partner. The illusions are set aside and your partner is just another wounded human being who is struggling to be healed.

          You become more intentional in your interactions. You behave in a more constructive manner.

          You value your partner’s needs and wishes as highly! as you do your own.

          You search within yourself for the strengths and abilities you are lacking. You become responsible for your own happiness and seek directly from your mate what your needs are.  

          You become more aware of your drive to be loving and whole and united. You begin to love unconditionally. You become spritual and you begin to rediscover your original nature

          You accept the difficulty of creating a good marriage. You realize it requires commitment,discipline, and courage to grow and change, marriage is hard work.

          Heather Mirassou



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          Shari Tenner wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • But throughout your post Heather the word you is a constant. After a while you needs to become we...or it is all one sided. My problem is that I always put his needs and wants before my own, always catered to and doted on him and still his needs were not met.  Remember when we were little playing on a sports team and the coach said  “There is no I in the word Team”  well that is how I view marriage to be.  A team effort for the good of the team, not competitive or one sided.  Maybe I’m wrong in what I feel a marriage should be. IDK



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          Dee Dee Shaw wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Another good book is “Two Fleas and No Dog” - funny title I know, but it helped me to realize how much I was depending on my hubby to make me happy and meet my needs (not that he shouldn’t do that to some degree.) It helped me to learn how to find happiness outside of dependence on him. I say all this, but it is *not directed to those dealing with infidelity*. I would kick him out in a skinny minute if there was unfaithfulness going on(and that is what I alluded to before.) I am not sure I’d take him back if he came back groveling either!
          I really loved the movie Fireproof because it addressed emotional infidelity (porn), and it was IMO very much directed at exposing the selfishness of men. I saw some ways they could have delveloped the plot more, but overall it was a very good movie (if you can get past the quality of the production.) It was filmed in Georgia.
          I wholeheartedly agree that you should look to yourselves for the final answer, but be careful about following your heart - it can decieve you! When I am making major decisions I try to do it analytically and remove emotions as much as possible. Make a list of pros and cons. Maybe even get someone who you are close to read over it and add to the list.  

          Sharing Hope,

          Dee Dee



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • almostfiveo,

          you are so right!  I just wanted to hear what others have to say.  my unfaithful husband now wants to fight for the 1 marriage he so carelessly threw away on a cheap piece of #$%!  I just don’t know if he is worth it!



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Mary,

          you have spoken what’s been on my mind over the last month since i started this dialogue...he really wants this marriage...but if his love was true he wouldn’t have slept around right?  how can i reconcile what he says with what he actually did?  i feel like Im going crazy sometimes..



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • almostfiveo,  you are correct and i agree..i guess the question is do i even want to be open to his desperate attempts to keep this marriage?  only i can answer that and i am confused as hell right now!



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Joyfull, your two cents is worth a hell of alot more than you give credit for...but YUCKY!!! I didn’t want to hear that...the humility my husband is showing actually pisses me off...I would rather he just be an arrogant butt so that I could easily write off this 14 year marriage as one huge mistake.  Honestly it angers me that he is so willing to do whatever it takes to keep the marriage, He begged me to go to counseling but guess what I begged him to go for the last 12 years and NOW he wants to follow through!  UUUGGGHHH!!!!! We have just started going but I just don’t know if this is what I want anymore.



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Platinum,

          oh my God how powerful.  serious food for thought.  i really need to figure out what i want plus we still have 3 kids at home under 18 and i get terrified thinking about the impact on them...they know we are working issues out but they don’t know what those issues are...



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • Dee Dee,

          I wish it was just lack of compatability.  I hung in this marriage for the last 14 years with the faith that it would be worth it...through prayer and intentionally loving him even when he wasn’t very lovable I kept at it.  I feel a great big load of disappointment and regret that he opted to sleep around instead of dealing with whatever issues he had...yeah life just sucks right now



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          Butterscotch wrote Oct 28, 2008
        • happymom,

          i made the same declaration regarding infidelity for the last 14 years...then when i found out i realized that there was much more to consider than just what he did...that is what i am working through now.  i can say that if i didn’t still have three kids at home and if he was a crappy dad i would exit in a hot minute but the truth is that he is a great father to our 6 kids and i don’t want to raise kids by myself...he can still be a great dad even if we are not together but i am trying to figure out how to leave him without telling my kids why....we have five boys and the impact of my husbands infidelity is much more far reaching than dealing with momentary feelings...i have to think this through...but i also have to take care of me....



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          Sweetnsassy wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • I mentioned in my earlier post that after 5 years following the discovery of my ex husband’s ongoing affair with my best friend I gathered enough courage to leave. Well, it wasn’t an easy decison for me either. After the initial shock, I decided to stay in the marriage and make an effort to work through it. I was determined to keep my home, my husband and all that I had worked so hard for. Even after some marriage counseling the stress, fear and anxiety got the best of me. During those 5 years I became bitter and depressed. I totally lost myself, my passion, and much of my self esteem. Looking back, the effort I made was a pure waste of time because I could never get over his betrayal, deception, lies and unfaithfullness. I tend to think about it the way you do. If he loved me he wouldn’t have slept around in the first place. If I had it to do over I would have kicked his sorry #@&!* out immediately. We didn’t have children involved and I know that brings up more issues and has some impact on your decision as well. I hope, by sharing my experience with you, it helps give you some insight. I realize it’s a very tough situation and my heart goes out to you.



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          Dee Dee Shaw wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • Butterscotch,
          That is hard. Words are easy to say when you aren’t facing the problem. I don’t know what I’d do. We have nine kids still at home. It would be hard. I talk big, but then I don’t know what I’d do if I thought he was sincerely sorry. Seperation is a bibilical thing. Reconciliation is too... I am sorry you are having to go through this. Forgivenesss wouldn’t be my issue, trust would! I will pray for you to have direction and peace to make the decision that is right for you and your family.  

          Dee Dee



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          Bobbi Bacha wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • Love is the Key here.  If you both in love, try to save the marriage.  If one of you are not in love, its best to get a divorce.  One person in love is not going to ever make the other person be in love.

          It takes two cups full in marriage.. If your cup is empty and your constantly pouring into the other cup and getting little or nothing back, then you have an empty cup.

          Both cups should remain full, and if its unequal.. then consider divorce.



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Butterscotch wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • greeneyedlady, dee dee and sweetnsassy,

          all 3 of you are right.  your words hit my heart.  i woke up this morning trying to figure out what to do. it seems like my head is focused on leaving but my heart can’t figure out how to do it...the love i thought we had for each other evidently doesn’t exist.  i was married to him in every meaning of the owrd..i guess he wasn’t.  i wish to god i didn’t have children at home...i really want to move on with my life without having to deal with the dysfunction and pain of my children that comes with divorce. i can’t get over his lies and decption..i just can’t seem to figure out how a person can do that and claim to love you with all of his heart...that doesn’t match up..i wihs i could stop loving him....i don’t know how long the journey is to healing but atleast i am moving forward in that direction.  i have forgiven him i just can’t shake the fact that after 14 years of struglling and loving each other he couldn’t keep his *&^%in his pants...i can’t even imagine trusting him ever again.  and why should i? i gave my all in this marriage, he accepted all the benefits of it and it still wasn’t enough to satisfy his lying @@#!  so i just keep taking it one day at a time...thanks soooooo much for your words, wisdom and the comments that make me laugh!



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          Shari Tenner wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • Hey Butterscotch,
          5 years ago my husband had a relationship with another woman due to the lack of whatever in our marriage. I took responsibility for the failure stepped up to the plate and played my heart out.  To no avail—he had another internet  sweety soon after.  The children were traumatized more by my staying and being unhappy than they are now with the impending separation.  They know what is going on they are like puppies and can sense the under currents and the nonverbals.  Both my kids are ok with the fact that our marriage may end.  They feel that we did them no good by staying together for them.



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        • 0 votes vote up vote up

          (華娃娃) ChinaDoll wrote Oct 29, 2008
        • Isn’t that there’s a saying something like once is forgiven, twice is forbidden, third is abundant -  I just created that COL (Crying Out Loud)



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